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Post by HLFanaticus on Feb 3, 2015 20:35:44 GMT -6
With all the talk about the Horizon League expanding and Coach Gary Waters of Cleveland saying that the League will "definitely" add a team after this season, is anyone concerned that the HL will actually have a team jump ship?
Did we see it coming when Butler left? Not everybody. Sure they went to back to back Final Fours. But that was just the Horizon League getting better...or so some thought. The League was actually in talks with some teams about bringing them aboard the HL at that time.
Now, with all of the procrastination of Jon LeCrone and the Board of Directors, have some schools become fed up with the stagnation of the HL? No move toward expansion; teams that should get better are not; Division among the publics and privates (the fans at least); 44% of the coaches are below average. What gives? Now that Valparaiso has developed some semblance of consistency, have they positioned themselves to be the next HL team to be poached by the A-10 or MVC?
Will Bryce Drew be the next coach to "ascend" to a Major Program?
Will the HL just remain a 12-14 rated 3rd tier league (behind the P5 and the group that includes the A-10, MVC, WCC, MWC, and AAC)?
What is the future of this League?
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Post by motorcitysam on Feb 4, 2015 11:35:00 GMT -6
I guess Valpo leaving wouldn't shock me, but I guess I would say it isn't likely. Loyola's move to the MVC kind of caught me by surprise, but in retrospect Loyola has a ton of money and they're in that great Chicago market. I don't think Valpo is really considered a Chicago market team, but they do have a lot of money in their endowment (200 million, according to Wiki).
I'd hate to see anyone leave the conference. Expansion is a must, and we're behind the curve on that already. Unlike some fans, I am in no rush for my school to leave the HL. It can be a very solid conference with the right leadership and vision.
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Post by kevinudm on Feb 4, 2015 17:57:30 GMT -6
Valpo and Green Bay are the two schools that have demonstrated basketball success for at least a few consecutive seasons. But Green Bay is pretty geographically remote to be attractive to other leagues. The MVC gave a close look at Valpo a couple of years ago (when they ultimately opted to go for Loyola), and would probably look at them again if there were a new need. The MVC also looked at UIC, but might be less interested in them now that they already have a Chicago school.
Valpo is a great school with a solid basketball program. But they're in a small market and don't draw particularly impressive crowds, so they're not a shoo-in if the MVC is ever looking for a new member.
But conference realignment in general seems to have come to a full stop. The Big East and the Big 12 conferences seem to be happy with 10 members for the foreseeable future, so there is no obvious reason to think that the realignment dominoes will start to fall again. The A-10 could lose UMass for football reasons, but they seem to be focusing in the mid-Atlantic for new members (George Mason and Davidson were their last two adds). And the MVC looks very stable at the moment, with zero indication that anyone would leave or that they would expand to 12 members.
Youngstown St. now has Jim Tressel as President, and Bo Pelini as football coach. So they could possibly look to upgrade football to FBS at some point and depart the HL; but that would take a number of years.
All of this leaves an opportunity for the HL. Since no one is likely to be poached, the HL has a chance to see programs prosper and remain in the conference. But across the board progress of the conference will require focus and funding, and it's not clear that the conference schools are prepared to ante up. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2015 14:23:52 GMT -6
All of this leaves an opportunity for the HL. Since no one is likely to be poached, the HL has a chance to see programs prosper and remain in the conference. But across the board progress of the conference will require focus and funding, and it's not clear that the conference schools are prepared to ante up. Good assessment kevinudm. In my opinion though, the only programs that look like they are really interested in lifting their programs to at least the A-10, MVC or MWC level are Oakland and Valpo. The jury is still out on Green Bay. They've got really good coaches, which is the foundation of any good program. Next, they are bringing in good players with high basketball IQ and talent. With redshirting and quality freshmen, they are setting themselves up for sustained success. The other 6 programs in the league tend to catch lightning in a bottle (we'll see about Green Bay come next season after Sykes is gone). Detroit, for example, has a great bunch of talent, but a coach on par with Milwaukee's Rob Jeter, who is just above my team's coach, Howard Moore. I also think Gary Waters is maybe a bit past his prime and Coach Slocumb...well |
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Feb 6, 2015 19:41:23 GMT -6
Interesting topic, here is my take on each team leaving.
CSU: I don't think their overall program is good enough for the A10 and I don't think there is a better fit for them than the HL.
YSU: I am dreaming that with their commitment to football they move out. They would be a good fit OVC right now. If that happened they would be doing the HL a favor as they are currently either not capable or committed to winning at hoops.
WSU: They seem kind of off the path for MVC geography. I can't see the A10 as long as Dayton is around. The OVC seems like a step down. I think they have one of the better overall hoops programs in the HL and should be better than they are currently.
Detroit: Their school could be a fit for the A10 and over the last 30 years no reason they didn't keep moving up like the Big East teams have. They just seem lost right now as they have access to talent, spend decent money and have a media market. Yet their home court isn't an advantage and the L's are mounting.
Oakland: I see them being in the HL for a long time. They run a nice program but this seems like a good match for their resources.
Valpo: Another program I respect as an opposing fan. They have a strong fan base, spend a decent amount of money and have a nice history. The ARC is my favorite place in the league to watch a game but it is not a nice facility...just a good atmosphere. I just don't think they are big time enough with their current program to succeed in the A10/MVC level. They would need a commitment to facilities/budget to step up.
UIC: Great market and good at sports other than basketball. I just don't see them doing anything to fix the hoops issue. They don't seem to have a large and loyal fan base despite being a large school in a very large city. I don't see a better fit than the HL for the current version of their program.
Milwaukee: Like UIC they are in a good market, are good at other sports and unlike UIC are competitive in hoops. They have a facilities issue that they are working to resolve. They have access to a large fan base but don't seem to be able to engage them. They are back page media in Milwaukee currently. If they could get their athletic and academic leaders aligned I could see them being attractive to the MVC.
Green Bay: That is an MVC kind of town. They have good facilities, are somewhat competitive in the other sports and are currently very attractive for hoops. They get decent media attention in their market. They draw a decent crowd by HL standards. They have a money issue and while they have a focus on fixing it I can't see a move up until it is resolved. The fund raising has improved but is probably a long way from being on the MVC radar even though a lot of other factors would look good on paper for the MVC. As much as I can dream I don't see them moving up from the HL anytime soon.
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