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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2019 21:02:32 GMT -6
Link per nhregister.com: UConn Heading back to Big EastLink per cbssports.com:UConn Moving Back to the Big EastBellarmine to the ASUN, UMKC back to the Summit and now, UConn is going to the Big East in 2020. While not the expansion news of a Power 5 conference, this move will indeed provide an interesting trickle down effect among at least 3 other leagues, namely the AAC, A-10, and possibly the MVC. There could be more conferences affected and it should be quite interesting. Who will the AAC backfill with? Rhode Island? VCU? Who will the A-10 backfill with? Loyola? Who will the MVC backfill with? Murray State, Milwaukee, UIC? Conferences and their presidents should be doing quite a bit of due diligence now and through the upcoming season.
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Post by commissioner on Jun 23, 2019 12:00:38 GMT -6
UMass would be another likely choice for the AAC, which would keep a New England presence (if they want one, rather than shrinking their extremely broad geographic footprint). There would also be several possible candidates from CUSA--indeed almost any team currently in CUSA could be a realistic candidate.
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Post by ougrizz05 on Jun 23, 2019 12:25:04 GMT -6
UMass would be another likely choice for the AAC, which would keep a New England presence (if they want one, rather than shrinking their extremely broad geographic footprint). There would also be several possible candidates from CUSA--indeed almost any team currently in CUSA could be a realistic candidate. I actually keep forgetting that the AAC is not CUSA. The broad geographic range reminds me of CUSA back in the day.
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Post by ougrizz05 on Jun 23, 2019 12:25:37 GMT -6
UMass would be another likely choice for the AAC, which would keep a New England presence (if they want one, rather than shrinking their extremely broad geographic footprint). There would also be several possible candidates from CUSA--indeed almost any team currently in CUSA could be a realistic candidate. I actually keep forgetting that the AAC is not CUSA. I forget that CUSA still exists.The broad geographic range reminds me of CUSA back in the day.
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Jun 24, 2019 13:43:12 GMT -6
What I find interesting about this move is everyone spends so much time talking about fit. Private vs. public, academics, location etc. Yet the fit here and perhaps the lesson for the HL to apply is that men's basketball is the straw that stirs the drink for these 11 schools. UConn doesn't really fit the league profile in many other ways but yet universally this is being accepted as a good move for UConn and the Big East.
As for AAC replacements this is going to be a football based decision. It would seem that a big public school that plays football in a good size media market would fit the bill based on the new TV contract that the league signed which pays about $7,000,000 per full member. While schools like Pitt, Boston College or Rutgers would make more sense in the AAC on the field they are not leaving the ACC or B10 media money gravy train.
My guess is that next full AAC member comes from a list of UMass, Buffalo, Eastern Michigan, Northern Illinois, UAB, UNC Charlotte, Old Dominion, UTEP or Georgia State. I am assuming EMU is in the Detroit TV world and NIU in Chicago. These schools are public schools with larger enrollments in above average tv markets with the potential to draw eyes for tv, in particular football. They also have the facilities or will soon have the facilities to fit the AAC for basketball.
In order I would rank them in order of best fit: Georgia State, Charlotte, UMass, Buffalo, UAB, UTEP, NIU, ODU and EMU.
The thing to watch here is the domino effect on other leagues. The only way I see it impacting the HL is if a CUSA team moves up to the AAC. Then I can see New Mexico State getting into CUSA. If that happened would any remaining WAC teams make their way to the Southland, Big Sky or Summit for example.
Alright I have spent too much time thinking about this.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2019 15:52:57 GMT -6
As for AAC replacements this is going to be a football based decision. It would seem that a big public school that plays football in a good size media market would fit the bill based on the new TV contract that the league signed which pays about $7,000,000 per full member. While schools like Pitt, Boston College or Rutgers would make more sense in the AAC on the field they are not leaving the ACC or B10 media money gravy train. My guess is that next full AAC member comes from a list of UMass, Buffalo, Eastern Michigan, Northern Illinois, UAB, UNC Charlotte, Old Dominion, UTEP or Georgia State. I am assuming EMU is in the Detroit TV world and NIU in Chicago. These schools are public schools with larger enrollments in above average tv markets with the potential to draw eyes for tv, in particular football. They also have the facilities or will soon have the facilities to fit the AAC for basketball. In order I would rank them in order of best fit: Georgia State, Charlotte, UMass, Buffalo, UAB, UTEP, NIU, ODU and EMU. The thing to watch here is the domino effect on other leagues. The only way I see it impacting the HL is if a CUSA team moves up to the AAC. Then I can see New Mexico State getting into CUSA. If that happened would any remaining WAC teams make their way to the Southland, Big Sky or Summit for example. Appreciate the insight gbphoenix1. I agree the AAC decision will be a football based one and the UConn move probably won't affect the HL. I really had not considered CUSA even though the bulk of the AAC is from that conference. Those conferences you mentioned, the MAC and CUSA, seem to be the ones that will be affected.
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Post by ougrizz05 on Jun 24, 2019 16:29:54 GMT -6
As for AAC replacements this is going to be a football based decision. It would seem that a big public school that plays football in a good size media market would fit the bill based on the new TV contract that the league signed which pays about $7,000,000 per full member. While schools like Pitt, Boston College or Rutgers would make more sense in the AAC on the field they are not leaving the ACC or B10 media money gravy train. My guess is that next full AAC member comes from a list of UMass, Buffalo, Eastern Michigan, Northern Illinois, UAB, UNC Charlotte, Old Dominion, UTEP or Georgia State. I am assuming EMU is in the Detroit TV world and NIU in Chicago. These schools are public schools with larger enrollments in above average tv markets with the potential to draw eyes for tv, in particular football. They also have the facilities or will soon have the facilities to fit the AAC for basketball. In order I would rank them in order of best fit: Georgia State, Charlotte, UMass, Buffalo, UAB, UTEP, NIU, ODU and EMU. The thing to watch here is the domino effect on other leagues. The only way I see it impacting the HL is if a CUSA team moves up to the AAC. Then I can see New Mexico State getting into CUSA. If that happened would any remaining WAC teams make their way to the Southland, Big Sky or Summit for example. Appreciate the insight gbphoenix1. I agree the AAC decision will be a football based one and the UConn move probably won't affect the HL. I really had not considered CUSA even though the bulk of the AAC is from that conference. Those conferences you mentioned, the MAC and CUSA, seem to be the ones that will be affected. I'd be surprised if EMU gets the invite. They are not relevant in the Detroit metro area for fans. They have very nice basketball and football stadiums, but nobody cares about EMU here. Their games have very little people in the stands, and I'd be shocked if anybody actually watches them on TV (any large #'s that is). They had a decent last few years in football. Prior to that, they hadn't made a bowl game in 29 years. Their last conference title was 1987. I hate to pile on EMU, but I'm just giving the facts and showing what most people in this area think about EMU sports. Also, they had to shut down a few of their sports over the last few years. There were court cases, and it was a mess. I believe there were budget cuts. I don't know if they are stable enough to join the AAC. The MAC is geographically compact in OH, MI, IN, NY. But of course, the AAC is TX, FL, and all over. It just doesn't seem like a good match right now.
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Jun 25, 2019 9:29:20 GMT -6
Grizz, I would be surprised too which is why I rated EMU last. It is the Loyola to the MVC move...grab a media market even if the team isn't widely regarded by the media and local people in that market. Tulane would be similar for the AAC.
The more I read it seems that the AAC doesn't want an extra football member at this time. I am surprised they can have a conference championship game with 11 teams that don't play a round robin schedule. Then again the rules are always changing.
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Post by vugrad1314 on Jun 25, 2019 10:04:44 GMT -6
I am very concerned as a Valpo fan that Loyola will be the A10's choice if a school like VCU does leave. At which point I would pray that Murray State is the choice but it sounds to me like the MVC is looking at schools to bolster its western geography and keep Missouri State from being too isolated. The trouble is there really isn't much west of Springfield worth adding unless we're looking at schools in Texas New Mexico Arizona or a school like Air Force needs a basketball home. Personally I would be pretty disappointed if Milwaukee or UIC were added as a fan of an MVC team. Nothing against those schools, they check a lot of boxes, but basketball drives the bus in the MVC and those schools just haven't done well enough recently for me to feel comfortable with them being added. I just don't think the MVC can afford to go to the Loyola well too many times especially when you get the boards of major universities involved such as Wisconsin or U of I. When that is the case there are always limits to how far those programs can climb because the administration probably doesn't want UIC or Milwaukee outshining the parent school for any length of time. (of course Alabama's board just approved a really nice new stadium for UAB so maybe I have nothing to worry about in this regard).
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 10:40:46 GMT -6
I am very concerned as a Valpo fan that Loyola will be the A10's choice if a school like VCU does leave. At which point I would pray that Murray State is the choice but it sounds to me like the MVC is looking at schools to bolster its western geography and keep Missouri State from being too isolated. The trouble is there really isn't much west of Springfield worth adding unless we're looking at schools in Texas New Mexico Arizona or a school like Air Force needs a basketball home. Personally I would be pretty disappointed if Milwaukee or UIC were added as a fan of an MVC team. Nothing against those schools, they check a lot of boxes, but basketball drives the bus in the MVC and those schools just haven't done well enough recently for me to feel comfortable with them being added. I just don't think the MVC can afford to go to the Loyola well too many times especially when you get the boards of major universities involved such as Wisconsin or U of I. When that is the case there are always limits to how far those programs can climb because the administration probably doesn't want UIC or Milwaukee outshining the parent school for any length of time. (of course Alabama's board just approved a really nice new stadium for UAB so maybe I have nothing to worry about in this regard). What do you mean, "...go to the Loyola well..."? In regards to the Big Sister school worried about the "little sister" outshining it, we've already experienced that. Urbana-Champaign for years kept us from having our own Law School, but we finally overcame that stumbling block. Also since our Hospital Campus is the largest in the country and the Illini don't have one, the trustees (majority of whom are UIUC graduates) finagled, schemed and out and out bullied their way to have our Hospital name changed from the UIC Medical Center to UI Health. We've got a new combination academic/dormitory building ready for fall and other happenings in our Master Plan project. They've tried to stop us, but we continue to prevail. I can't stand them. But anyway, I digress.
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Post by vugrad1314 on Jun 25, 2019 10:51:39 GMT -6
I meant take a chance on a program solely for the market it could theoretically bring if the program ever got good. I feel like that rarely works and when it does it only works so many times. UIC is showing great commitment to facilities building and is a fantastic institution but that basketball program I am concerned would be a drag. They really don't have any history of being consistently strong. Loyola at least had some history. You can rip Valpo for its performance in the MVC its first two years all you want and I won't stop you especially given the questionable institutional commitment to facilities development. I've been very vocal about this issue on other boards but I'm sure you can understand why I would be nervous and disappointed if an addition were made to the MVC that smacks of grabbing a program just to gain a media market.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2019 18:42:28 GMT -6
The only real history Loyola had before getting an invite to the Valley was their championship period. After that, they made a nice run in '85. Since then, I could argue that UIC had been a better basketball program until the retirement of Jimmy Collins. We all know the lucky break Loyola got basically because of the Missouri State President and the public/private ridiculousness. The Ramblers fortunately, took advantage of it.
Say, for argument's sake, that the A-10 comes a calling for the Ramblers. The natural replacement should be the Flames. Chicago is home to a plethora of Valley alums and would still enjoy a trip to the Windy City to watch their alma mater play in Chicago. Chicago isn't just a media market, but a premier media market and the MVC understands that.
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Jul 19, 2019 7:53:09 GMT -6
UIC would be a long shot for the MVC in my opinion. Loyola was able to lay out and execute a plan to improve every aspect of their program. What is the UIC plan? Just as importantly for a public school where are the resources going to come from to execute it? UIC should be so much better at basketball than they are. Is there any plan to reverse a decade of incompetence?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2019 13:04:23 GMT -6
UIC would be a long shot for the MVC in my opinion. Loyola was able to lay out and execute a plan to improve every aspect of their program. What is the UIC plan? Just as importantly for a public school where are the resources going to come from to execute it? UIC should be so much better at basketball than they are. Is there any plan to reverse a decade of incompetence? UIC gave their presentation to Valley representatives. They gave them the low down on our "Master Plan", including new soccer and basketball arenas. Valley reps had already seen our baseball stadium and was impressed. The Valley baseball coaches wanted a school with baseball and were quite upset when it didn't happen. UIC was basically the presumptive choice until that last minute pitch by the Ramblers. UIC has the resources. They've just made the wrong decisions when it comes to hoops coaches: Howard Moore. Then extending Moore. Then Steve McClain, and then extending him! While other Illinois schools are declining in enrollment (except UIUC), UIC is steadily growing. The University enrollment is well over 30,000, the State government is moving in the right direction and outgoing AD, Garrett Klassy, got a decent naming rights deal for the Pavilion (Credit One Arena). The higher ups just need to make the right coaching hire!
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Jul 19, 2019 14:42:33 GMT -6
Taking Valpo while giving UIC virtually no consideration during the last MVC acquisition makes me think UIC is further down the list.
Master plans are great. Having the leaders in place to secure the money to execute the plan is where the rubber meets the road IMO.
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