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Post by kevinudm on Nov 27, 2017 21:35:18 GMT -6
The WAC suffered a double whammy today. The conference is always eager for new members and for some time had been courting DII UC-San Diego - but UCSD has accepted an invite to the Big West Conference. Worse yet for the WAC, CSU Bakersfield announced that they are leaving the WAC for the Big West. It's possible that the WAC could survive this situation. Cal Baptist is moving up from DII to join the WAC next year and Bakersfield isn't scheduled to leave until 2020. Barring any other changes, that would leave the WAC with 8 members even after Bakersfield's departure. But more changes are likely to come. Chicago St. looks unlikely to stay in D1 athletics and may not even survive as a university. UMKC is re-evaluating its options, including conference affiliation or dropping out of D1 athletics. And the other six WAC members are likely redoubling their efforts to find new homes. If one or two of them bolt, it could be all over for the WAC. And there are certainly possibilities for more moves: - Seattle would love to get back into the WCC. The WCC could add Seattle and Denver (from the Summit) to go to 12
- The latest moves from the Big West will leave them at 11 members. They might look at Grand Canyon or Utah Valley to reach an even dozen.
- The Southland Conference has 13 members, after Oral Roberts left them for the Summit. UT Rio Grande would be a good geographic fit to get them to an even 14.
I'm still dubious that Grand Canyon and New Mexico St. make sense for the Horizon League; they are not geographic fits or cultural fits. But they would certainly raise the league's athletic profile. If Jon LeCrone is serious about expanding the conference, this may be his opportunity.
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Post by commissioner on Nov 27, 2017 22:38:18 GMT -6
Grand Canyon and New Mexico State not only make sense, they are the most sensible options, and perhaps the only sensible options, for the Horizon--if they'll have us. They are the only two schools we might possibly snag that would raise our profile, raise our RPI and other computer numbers, raise our average attendance, and that have a proven ability to contend for post-season berths. From our end, this should be a no brainer, unless the Horizon presidents have decided they don't really care if the Horizon competes on the level of the America East, Northeast, Big South, etc.
But there's always Fort Wayne and Bellarmine.
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Post by bear2020 on Nov 27, 2017 22:48:45 GMT -6
Agree 100% need those teams in the horizon and wac is ripe for picking the move would make sense for those schools also a more stable conference with better competition
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Post by oklahomamick on Nov 28, 2017 10:05:59 GMT -6
Of course New Mexico St. and Grand Canyon University basketball programs would help the HL. But will the presidents vote for it? How many HL presidents must approve? Detroit, Green Bay, Cleveland St and Youngstown St most likely would vote no.
Speaking of this, I wonder if IUPUI received 100% votes from the HL presidents.
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Post by ougrizz05 on Nov 28, 2017 11:43:09 GMT -6
Grand Canyon and New Mexico State not only make sense, they are the most sensible options, and perhaps the only sensible options, for the Horizon--if they'll have us. They are the only two schools we might possibly snag that would raise our profile, raise our RPI and other computer numbers, raise our average attendance, and that have a proven ability to contend for post-season berths. From our end, this should be a no brainer, unless the Horizon presidents have decided they don't really care if the Horizon competes on the level of the America East, Northeast, Big South, etc. But there's always Fort Wayne and Bellarmine. The travel is ridiculous. And I'm sure it will be expensive. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2017 14:12:45 GMT -6
Of course New Mexico St. and Grand Canyon University basketball programs would help the HL. But will the presidents vote for it? How many HL presidents must approve? Detroit, Green Bay, Cleveland St and Youngstown St most likely would vote no. Speaking of this, I wonder if IUPUI received 100% votes from the HL presidents. It was said that the vote was unanimous. Don't know if that was true or not, but it was said. |
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Post by oklahomamick on Nov 28, 2017 14:35:12 GMT -6
Of course New Mexico St. and Grand Canyon University basketball programs would help the HL. But will the presidents vote for it? How many HL presidents must approve? Detroit, Green Bay, Cleveland St and Youngstown St most likely would vote no. Speaking of this, I wonder if IUPUI received 100% votes from the HL presidents. It was said that the vote was unanimous. Don't know if that was true or not, but it was said. Interesting....The votes came out public on the Motor City Madness. UIC and Valpo were the only ones who voted against it. Still the question remains, what HL presidents would not vote for the Arizona and New Mexico teams? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2017 14:55:50 GMT -6
At this point of the Horizon League's continued descent into the abyss of low major status, what teams would want to be a part of the League? I've been a staunch supporter of the conference for years, every year thinking that year would be the year things turn around and we're a top 10-12 conference again. But alas, the opposite continues to happen. We fall further and further into obscurity. Grand Canyon could be waiting for a WCC invite. NMSU might be looking to get into the MWC or the Sun Belt.
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Post by commissioner on Nov 28, 2017 15:00:54 GMT -6
Grand Canyon and New Mexico State not only make sense, they are the most sensible options, and perhaps the only sensible options, for the Horizon--if they'll have us. They are the only two schools we might possibly snag that would raise our profile, raise our RPI and other computer numbers, raise our average attendance, and that have a proven ability to contend for post-season berths. From our end, this should be a no brainer, unless the Horizon presidents have decided they don't really care if the Horizon competes on the level of the America East, Northeast, Big South, etc. But there's always Fort Wayne and Bellarmine. The travel is ridiculous. And I'm sure it will be expensive. Then essentially you accept continued decline. The cost of travel isn't actually as big a deal as many instinctively think. It's one trip a year for the men's and women's basketball teams, 1 trip every two years for soccer teams (OU played in Dallas this year non-conference--is that really that much cheaper than going to Phoenix?). Many of the smaller sports won't have to go at all--they just worry about the league championships. The baseball teams would be the worst, but OU chose already to play in Florida and Tennessee last spring. You need warm weather games in March... where else in the country do they play early spring baseball? Hmmmm....). The travel costs would be on the western teams. But they already have enormous travel costs. In the WAC they already have to travel to Chicago (Chicago State), Kansas City, Seattle, and less distant but hard to get to places such as Bakersfield. Las Cruces to Detroit is basically the same distance as Las Cruces to Seattle (about 30 miles difference). I'm not saying it's not relevant (and student class time is probably the more significant travel cost than $$). Only that at some point you've got to decide if you want the conference to reverse its decline or not. I wish DePaul and Marquette and Xavier and Dayton were interested in joining, or even Loyola and Valparaiso, but they're not. So you can suck it up and hit the road, or suck it up and invite Fort Wayne and Bellarmine. Pluses and minuses both ways, but one way suggest continued stagnation, the other does not. |
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Post by commissioner on Nov 28, 2017 15:04:47 GMT -6
At this point of the Horizon League's continued descent into the abyss of low major status, what teams would want to be a part of the League? I've been a staunch supporter of the conference for years, every year thinking that year would be the year things turn around and we're a top 10-12 conference again. But alas, the opposite continues to happen. We fall further and further into obscurity. Grand Canyon could be waiting for a WCC invite. NMSU might be looking to get into the MWC or the Sun Belt. Chuck is right. The fact is, it is probably academic. We missed our chance. We were afraid of travel costs, and of having a private university, and decided that decline was the better option. This might--probably not, but might--be an opportunity to revisit that decision. But a lot of administrators, and fans it appears, think decline is the better option. Don't get me wrong--there are strong arguments there, and maybe it is. We can survive on the level of the Big South and Atlantic Sun, and we'll still get that automatic bid as long as they have automatic bids to every conference. But that's the choice. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2017 15:49:10 GMT -6
If that's the case Commissioner, that is a very sad commentary on the State of the Horizon League!
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Post by csudave on Dec 2, 2017 19:56:01 GMT -6
An interesting line about NMSU in this article about the Aggies clinching a bowl berth: “More than likely, the Aggies (6-6, 4-4) will play in the Nova Home Loans Arizona Bowl in Tucson, Arizona, on Dec. 29. NMSU chancellor and president Garrey Carruthers indicated on Nov. 16 that it was possibly the only Sun Belt bowl bid the athletic department could afford to accept and the Arizona Bowl executive director Alan Young told the Las Cruces Sun-News he would be happy to host them.” If sending the football team to an eastern location for a bowl game isn’t in the NMSU athletic budget, I️ doubt sending basketball and non revenue sports to HL cities ever year is either. Even if GCU could afford it, I️ assume a western travel partner would be ideal. Source: www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/new-mexico-st-beats-south-alabama-ends-57-year-bowl-drought/2017/12/02/35e421de-d7ca-11e7-9ad9-ca0619edfa05_story.html?utm_term=.4fe79643e036 |
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Dec 2, 2017 21:28:07 GMT -6
I don't fully know how this factors in but don't most bowl games require the teams to guarantee a certain number of sold tickets?
Perhaps it isn't the travel cost but the total guarantee outlay that is a factor?
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Post by gbphoenix1 on Dec 6, 2017 14:41:41 GMT -6
CSUDave, you have a valid point. In reading about it, NMSU does have some financial concerns that I wasn't fully aware of.
I had read in the past that some of these bowls are fleecing teams of money which obviously wouldn't help NNMSU.
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